Planting New Roots: Starting A Second Career In The Wine Industry (Part 1)

Interview with Daria Kholodilina - “I'm a wine tourism practitioner with several years of experience in international and domestic tourism. I have worked with media, corporations, NGOs, politicians, diplomats, and governments. I speak 5 languages and know Georgian wine very well.”

Wine is one of those industries that people tend to romanticize. Everyone has a friend who talks about their dream to quit the office hustle, move to Napa Valley and start their life over as a sommelier. They want to spend their days sipping wine, chatting with cultured people, and explaining the nuances of a particularly leggy Cabernet.

So why not do it? What is that keeps people from perusing their boozy passion? If you ask most people, they don't know where to start. If you don't have any connections, finding a foothold in what feels like an exclusive club can be daunting. Everyone who knows wine already has a network, and everyone who has a network doesn't need another wine hobbyist.

At Misulis group, we help people find the job of their dreams no matter what industry, so I reached out to Daria Kholodilina, a Ukrainian native and co-owner of Trails & Wines, a Georgian tourism company. Daria, along with her husband Zviad Kelenjeridze, started the company in 2018 to share their passion for wine and the beauty of Georgia.

Daria didn't have a background in wine, and she didn't have connections to a vineyard or any help breaking into the industry. Instead, she had an experience in tourism, a weekend wine-tasting hobby, and a vision for the job she wanted. In this two-part interview, we discussed entering the wine industry, navigating small business life as a new mom, and working in social media. She shared her journey from her first interaction with wine as a youth in Crimea to her current reality as a business owner, wine writer, and staple in the Georgia wine scene.

Q: Can you briefly explain the process of breaking into the wine industry and how you started?

A: Work in wine is not so complicated. You can just get trained, attend different courses, and then you are good to go. You don't have to have higher education; relevant knowledge is more important. There are various wine courses in Georgia and even more internationally. From what I saw when I began in Georgia, there was an educational vacuum. There were courses for people who wanted to work in winemaking. However, there needed to be more if you wanted to work in wine communication. Now there are several wine schools and international courses available here. I took classes through WSET (wine and sprite educational trust), a London-based organization that offers courses in Georgia, and I'm happy with them. It gives a broader understanding of wine, and then you can specialize in local wine and see how it fits into the system.

In Georgia, working in the field pays well; generally, working in bars does not. That's why I never wanted to be a sommelier. I'm more interested in giving people wine experiences than standing behind a bar. I'm mostly organizing and sometimes guiding wine tours. If you take daily rates, the guide job is better paid than the sommelier job.

Q: So you didn't do any sommelier training?

A: No, I thought I would not work in service, so I specifically studied wine communication.

Q: Can you explain a bit more about what is wine communication?

A: It's a way to explain wine so that people will understand it, enjoy themselves, and not find it boring. It's about defining what's in their glass so that even the most novice will not be yawing - just helping them understand better and enjoy it and want to dig more or come for another glass and explore. That's my take on it, at least.

Q: If you had to choose which was more helpful, would it be the courses or your hobby of tasting in your own time?

A: The hobby because it takes the interest first, and then the curious follows. You can talk to winemakers during tastings, who will explain things if you are interested enough. Wine is not just 8000 years of unbroken winemaking traditions. It's also why this wine is like this and the other is like that. The course is beneficial, though. Without education, I would not be able to do my job well because it gives a framework and context to understand everything.

Q: Did you attend university, and if so, what did you study? And how did that lead you down the path to wine?

A: Yes, I have a master's in translation and interpreting in Ukraine, and my undergraduate was the same. When I moved to Georgia, I needed to master Georgian and found a job with the national tourism board. They needed a person who could speak several languages and organize campaigns. That was a good start for me as I started translating Facebook posts, and then they moved me to the marketing department, where I planned and attended travel fairs representing Georgia. It gave me a bigger picture of Georgian tourism. I was traveling on weekends and drinking wine in my free time. I was curious about wine and started reading about it, and then I attended the courses. After that, I wanted to give people this more conscious experience with wine, not only drinking a lot, which is always possible here. And to be honest, the office job got a bit boring after four years, so I switched to self-employed, and so far, I have enjoyed it. Before the switch, I had only office jobs. I worked in tourism for four years and then switched over to this.

Q: So you did language, interpreting, then sports journalism, then tourism, then wine?

A: Languages were the key to any door for me. I'm from Ukraine, so I speak Ukrainian and Russian fluently, English and German. It gave me many keys because I also always liked writing, so it was beneficial for translation and sports writing because I was very fond of football. When I moved to football, rugby was more important, so now my football is only on tv, but yea, here I ended up being in tourism first in writing, then I learned by doing.

Q: What would you say was the total time from "ok, I'm interested in wine" and taking it as a hobby to the end of "I've taken this class, and I'm now working in wine."?

A: Oh, it was a long way. I attended my first wine tasting at a winery in Crimea when I was ten. Of course, I wasn't allowed to drink, but they allowed me to sniff. I thought the wine was some sour drink, but the smell was lovely, and I wondered how this could come from this drink. When I was allowed to drink, I was a student, and of course, I didn't have enough money. I had to drink some cheap stuff, but I tried to pick some exciting wines. I also lived in Germany for a while, and the exposure to German-style light white wines was delightful. When I came to Georgia, the amber wine opened up for me. In the beginning, I thought it was just a bit weird, very rustic style, but then I realized if it's well-crafted, it's something different. The first amber wine I fell in love with was the Rkatsiteli, Mstvane, and Kisi blend from Naotari winery. It was something different for me. I had never tasted such a complex wine before.

Then in 2015, I became more active. I just started asking more questions when I was wine-tasting and reading more. By 2016-2017, I had already started paying more attention to what was in the glass and actively learning.

I helped co-author a book about Georgian wine, a guidebook. There is a sommelier and wine writer Miquel Hudin who lives in Spain. He's an American living in Spain and offered to collaborate in writing a book about Georgian wine because I knew where to eat and drink and how to travel around the country. I mainly contributed to the travel aspect. I became even more interested as I worked on the book and read what he wrote. It was gratifying to work with such an experienced wine writer. I soon realized if people saw my name on the book, they would ask more questions, and if I said, "uhh, I have no idea," it would not be good. I decided to attend some Georgian courses. Then in 2018, I switched to wine tourism completely, so basically, between the book and the switch to fieldwork was one year.

Q: Where does the majority of your work happen? At vineyards, online, in face-to-face meetings?

A: Currently, it's mostly online, but I worked in the field for two years in 18 and 19. They were very active but exhausting years because I was taking any tour that would come my way. I spent more days in Kakheti than at home. At the time, I lived with flatmates, and they barely saw me, so it was a bit awkward because they barely recognized me when I was home. By the end of 2018, I moved in with my partner, and he also quit his job, and we started doing more tours together. We registered a company, and the scale grew, but all the money stayed in the family, which was good for us. By the end of 2019, we celebrated our company's first anniversary, and we celebrated with our business partner.

When we came home, I said, "next year, I don't want to guide at all. I want to switch to management and planning, and I don't want to guide at all," and in 2020, I didn't guide at all, so dreams come true haha. But I had some wine projects that involved some travel. By July 2020, I missed traveling, and then there was a project I got commissioned from several Georgian wine importers to record interviews with winemakers that were exporting wines to Germany/France/Netherlands so they could publish them and encourage sales. It was fun, almost two months of intense travel, drinking, and asking questions. It was exactly wine communication and not tourism. In 2021 we had quite a successful season, and I wasn't going into the field. Then in 2021, I got pregnant, so it was not the most favorable situation to be every day on the road, and wine-wise, I stopped drinking wine last august. And this year, I am mostly planning. For example, this week, we have two tours, and next week, we have 2 or 3 tours, so I'm talking to the client and finding out the wants. We only do individual tours, so we always ask what they want to see/ what they want to do/ which activities. Then we offer them a program, and once they decide, I arrange all the related bookings at bars and restaurants and find guides.

Q: many people think of wine as a "dream industry." They say, "I’d love to do that," but then don't know how to start. What advice do you have for people interested in pursuing a career in wine? What are the first steps for getting started?

A: When the war in Ukraine started (it was also close to Georgia), we started thinking about the plan if Russia also decided to explore this frontier again.  So we have family in New York, and we thought, what if. So I saw what you could do in wine over there, and that was refreshing because there is also a book called the cork dork. I recommend it to people who want to work in wine but don't know how – basically what, I realized that you have to work much harder in the United States to become someone because the crowd is very demanding. You must memorize a huge wine list, and there are lots of regions. In Georgia, in wine bars, and basically in all restaurants, the wine menu is mainly Georgian wines, so you don't have to memorize so many little things, and the crowd is not so demanding. They want to be like, "what will go with this one" they are more like, "a lot of wine, a lot of food." Of course, there is also a sophisticated segment, but it's small, and the tourists are not always asking many questions. So here it's easier to find a job if you find Georgian, of course, because locals get annoyed when all the restaurants don't speak the native language, at least a bit, to be polite.

The complicated is to survive with the salary.

In Ukraine, I also had insight into how the market works there. Also, at least in big cities, sommeliers are well-educated, and crowds are demanding. Even regular people would know what kind of wine they want to have with their meal. And some friends of mine are not very sophisticated drinkers but are quite well-traveled. When they came here, they asked tricky questions based on their knowledge of other places. So in Ukraine, the crowd is much more educated, and to find a wine job, you need to be also really skilled, but it can also be fun. And sometimes well paid in the good restaurants.

I don't know about other countries. I also saw some friends of mine starting jobs in wine in Germany. One big friend of mine, one of those importers who commissioned me in the videos, Zoltan, runs a wine importing company, and he's a musician. He was playing in the orchestra, so he came to form a music background, but he is married to a Georgian and very close to many winemakers, so he decided to export from here at some point. And now he has quit his music job and is focused on wine events. He goes to different establishments, offers wine, explains a lot about it, and organizes tasting events. He works hard to promote Georgian wine, natural wine, and his wine in and around Berlin. It seems like if he quits that job, it is working. I hope it works for him because he chose this path.

Also, I've heard the saying that "wine is the best second career." So first, you do something, then realize you are interested in wine and decide to create an opportunity for yourself. Many Georgian winemakers, when you talk to them, we're physicians or economists or painters or whatever and then decided to make wine because of what their ancestors and friends did. They bought a dacha summer house with a vineyard, so there are a lot of stories like this. So, wine is an excellent second career, so don't be afraid if you want to start. Just plan from which side you want to start. Do you want to make your hands dirty in the vineyard, work in the bar, talk to people, or start a blog to do something on the internet? But the internet is the longest path because until you get paid, it's a long way. A lot of unpaid work. There are many ways one can choose. Or import wine. Or open a shop, or whatever. Tasting clubs, there are a lot of opportunities but don't quit your job first. Try if you like it and if it brings money, then switch. It's a good weekend job to start. I was also working in the office and traveling on weekends. In 2016 or 17, I started a blog about traveling around Georgia. Sometimes people asked me to show them around for money, so I gave city tours, and I always said yes. That's basically how I started. I decided if it works for people like it and me, and it is always reading a lot. So it's not like I just started without knowing anything. First, I got knowledge. So learn a bit, then go to the field. That's my advice

Q: You mentioned specifically in Georgia that many people started as a 2nd career because there is some connection to wine in their roots. How realistically attainable is it to work in the industry without connections or background?

A: Eventually, you make connections. My first connections were people I was visiting on weekends, the bars, and tasting, but there were some projects where I interviewed some winemakers I didn't know. Still, we met, and after 2hours and several glasses of wine, we became acquainted, and maybe I'm lucky, but I don't see a lot of meaningful competition. Of course, there are, and there are cliques of winemakers, and if you are friends with one, maybe the other won't like you. Some people are into hardcore natural wine, people who are more into industrial wine and don't like the funkiness of natural wine, and sometimes they clash on the internet. I wouldn't say there are big unpleasant fights in wine, but it's easy to make connections

Q: Originally, you are from Ukraine, and your husband is from Georgia. Both of these are big drinking counties. Has your cultural background influenced your career decisions or pushed you toward the wine industry?

A: Well, I would say my husband already got the ready package because I was already speaking Georgian, and I was a legal resident, and I already knew something about wine. So I already learned a lot. I think he admits, too when we met and started talking and wine popped up, he said that Rkatsiteli was for him. He hates it. I was like, why? Because he said to me when I say Rkatsiteli, I think of nasty hangovers, bad homemade oxidized wine, and you drink a lot and feel bad the next day. But now he's tasted so many nice ones with me that it's his favorite grape because it s the most approachable and diverse. So we learn from each other. I know from him how Georgian society thinks and how to approach and talk to people. My husband is quite diplomatic, and I'm very straightforward, so he's really helpful, and also I speak Georgian quite well. Still, sometimes my Georgian is also straightforward, so I don't use any conditionals, and he helps me figure it out because it's essential to make a good impression.

Q: Everyone knows that the pandemic hit tourism especially hard. How did covid-19 impact your business?

A: The pandemic was annihilating for us, because we offer the real life experiences. Even though we did online tours (not to successfully), online tastings (very successfully) and then started receiving guests, when Georgia opened up, we are still far from pre-pandemic numbers, and the war in Ukraine doesn't make it easier. We keep spreading knowledge about us and Georgia in general and hope for the best though!

Q: If you could start your professional life over, what things would you do differently, and what things would you do the same?

A: I did my bachelor's in 2010 and my masters in 2011. It would have been beneficial if I had taken some project management courses. There was nothing like this in our curricula because I studied languages. It was classical theology and practical interpretation. It was extremely useful for me, but I would take at least courses if I had known that project management and resources management were available. Now I have bought a course on Coursera, and google gave me a scholarship for project management, but I couldn't. I started when my son was two months old and slept a lot, and then the day I bought it, the next day, he started sleep progression and never slept as well as before, so I abandoned the idea. I had to say I couldn't do this and try again later. I want to get certificates that would also help me be more competitive internationally because in Ukraine and Georgia, sometimes you can find a job without being certified, so obviously, I can run projects. I organize a lot of things but having a certificate is very important.

Thank you to Daria for taking the time to sit and chat with me all things wine. If this interview got you interested, look for part two where we will talk about working motherhood, and social media. 

If you are interested in booking a tour with Daria or learning more about wine communication, you can find her at www.trailsandwines.com and her motherhood social media pages at instagram.com/motheringeorgia.